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Post by dasbow on Jul 31, 2008 14:18:47 GMT -5
And some deny that they ever held the other position. I don't care if someone changes his mind, as long as he admits it and explains what it was that changed his thinking. I agree Once again, we move toward consensus! |
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Post by kaboobie92 on Jul 31, 2008 14:22:48 GMT -5
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Post by kaboobie92 on Jul 31, 2008 14:26:48 GMT -5
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Post by wienerpoopie on Jul 31, 2008 14:32:58 GMT -5
I read this but will not believe any of it without verification because it’s from an anonymous person on an internet blog. |
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Post by wienerpoopie on Jul 31, 2008 14:37:24 GMT -5
This I don’t agree with but it’s not significant enough to sway my vote, and I have not decided on a candidate yet. |
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Post by Fistor on Jul 31, 2008 14:45:42 GMT -5
I certainly wouldn't mind some sort of link that verifies Obama actually said those things. I know you're super-eager to throw Obama under the bus at each and every turn, but how about a little verification? And, good to know McCain is so squeaky clean, since you have yet to post anything about him that might be considered dishonest - you did say you research both candidates equally, right? Certainly you don't have an agenda and want to smear Obama any way you can. That would be irresponsible. |
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Post by Fistor on Jul 31, 2008 14:57:00 GMT -5
Do you have any proof that the Pledge of Allegiance was being recited here? Because it wasn't. It was the National Anthem, and he was singing it. Here's a picture of Obama with his hand over his heart, saying the Pledge:  Here's a link explaining how Obama, in fact, isn't a baby-eating monster who spits on the flag: www.snopes.com/politics/obama/anthem.aspAny more unsubstantiated smear tactics you'd like to share? |
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Post by scooterfanatic on Jul 31, 2008 14:59:51 GMT -5
This I don’t agree with but it’s not significant enough to sway my vote, and I have not decided on a candidate yet. I'm pretty sure this was addressed. It wasn't the pledge, it was the national anthem, and where I come from, putting your hand on your heart is optional. There are other instances, before and after this picture was taken, where Obama DID place his hand on his heart and DID recite the pledge. |
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Post by Fistor on Jul 31, 2008 15:12:27 GMT -5
This I don’t agree with but it’s not significant enough to sway my vote, and I have not decided on a candidate yet. I'm pretty sure this was addressed. It wasn't the pledge, it was the national anthem, and where I come from, putting your hand on your heart is optional. There are other instances, before and after this picture was taken, where Obama DID place his hand on his heart and DID recite the pledge. Scroll up a tick. |
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Post by ratrad on Jul 31, 2008 15:43:38 GMT -5
so Obama promising that he would repeal the patriot act, and then voting for it is my opinion? That shows that he is a flip-flopper. Our country dosen't need someone who cant even make up his own mind. And it just shows how he is a typical politician, lies to the American people. He promised to repeal it and voted for it because he was bullied into it. McCain is a flip flopper too. I've told you over and over to look at his positions when he was running against Bush in 2004, but you keep refusing. Therefore, any of us trying to reason with you is probably futile. |
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Post by ratrad on Jul 31, 2008 15:45:46 GMT -5
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Post by speedbump on Jul 31, 2008 23:05:25 GMT -5
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Post by kaboobie92 on Aug 1, 2008 6:20:17 GMT -5
so Obama promising that he would repeal the patriot act, and then voting for it is my opinion? That shows that he is a flip-flopper. Our country dosen't need someone who cant even make up his own mind. And it just shows how he is a typical politician, lies to the American people. He promised to repeal it and voted for it because he was bullied into it. McCain is a flip flopper too. I've told you over and over to look at his positions when he was running against Bush in 2004, but you keep refusing. Therefore, any of us trying to reason with you is probably futile. I have, but why don't you do a little research? You never prove points, you only ask questions. So you go find me some examples. |
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Post by scooterfanatic on Aug 1, 2008 6:51:43 GMT -5
internkylebusch,
If you seriously think the Republican Party isn't for big government, you need to get your head examined. The only true "small government" parties are the Libertarian and Constitution parties.
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Post by Fistor on Aug 1, 2008 6:52:21 GMT -5
He promised to repeal it and voted for it because he was bullied into it. McCain is a flip flopper too. I've told you over and over to look at his positions when he was running against Bush in 2004, but you keep refusing. Therefore, any of us trying to reason with you is probably futile. I have, but why don't you do a little research? You never prove points, you only ask questions. So you go find me some examples. Why do research when making up lies about a candidate seems like so much fun? Like the ones you made up earlier on this page, for example. |
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Post by dasbow on Aug 1, 2008 6:58:20 GMT -5
internkylebusch, If you seriously think the Republican Party isn't for big government, you need to get your head examined. The only true "small government" parties are the Libertarian and Constitution parties. You got that right. The Republicans were for smaller government. Then they got hold of the reins of power, and that went out the window. I almost dislike big government conservatism (to me an oxymoron) as much as I dislike big government liberalism. If a third party was viable, I'd be in, but it's not. So now we have to try to steer the Republicans back to a more conservative, smaller government approach. |
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Post by kaboobie92 on Aug 1, 2008 7:03:29 GMT -5
I have, but why don't you do a little research? You never prove points, you only ask questions. So you go find me some examples. Why do research when making up lies about a candidate seems like so much fun? Like the ones you made up earlier on this page, for example. Yes Fistor. Obviously if you visited the link you'd know that I didnt make them up. I guess Ignorance Is Bliss |
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Post by scooterfanatic on Aug 1, 2008 7:04:11 GMT -5
Republican economic policy I believe is this: give tax breaks to the richest businesses and individuals because theoretically they are the ones who create wealth. Give them a tax break and their good fortune will "trickle down" to the middle class.
The only problem is now because of free trade agreements, those corporations are taking that extra money and using it to create wealth in other countries. Nike doesn't manufacture a single shoe in the United States, because the CEO feels that "Americans don't want to make shoes." I guarantee you there are thousands of unemployed people who would be happy to make shoes. In fact, New Balance does manufacture some product here.
I think the main flaw in the conservative laissez-faire economic argument is that businesses and corporations always have the principle of the free market in mind. In the extreme, it's economic anarchism. A completely free economy is unsustainable, as corporations would eventually merge into bigger and bigger entities until monopolies ruled the market. We have historical examples even, just look at the US during the turn of the 20th century where the market was flooded with robber barons. I realize not all republicans and conservatives are libertarians and recognize that some regulation in the market is needed, though.
Reganomics doesn't work today because of NAFTA, plain and simple. I think there should be a law that states a corporation should get not one red cent in tax breaks unless a certain percentage of their manufacturing is done right here. Companies like Nike suck wealth from the American market and put nothing back. After all, if every business moved overseas, who would be left to buy those sneakers and t-shirts and cars?
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Post by Fistor on Aug 1, 2008 7:12:19 GMT -5
Why do research when making up lies about a candidate seems like so much fun? Like the ones you made up earlier on this page, for example. Yes Fistor. Obviously if you visited the link you'd know that I didnt make them up. I guess Ignorance Is Bliss I did visit the link. And I returned with questions that you never bothered to answer. Also, when I returned, I found another post of yours slamming Obama - this one about his horrible flag injustices. I proved those wrong, in case you didn't bother to look. Don't tell me you didn't follow the link I posted. Because that would be deliciously ironic. And blissfully ignorant of you. |
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Post by speedbump on Aug 1, 2008 9:12:55 GMT -5
Why do research when making up lies about a candidate seems like so much fun? Like the ones you made up earlier on this page, for example. Yes Fistor. Obviously if you visited the link you'd know that I didnt make them up. I guess Ignorance Is Bliss Why don't you go ahead and watch that video I posted a few posts back. |
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Post by kaboobie92 on Aug 1, 2008 11:42:08 GMT -5
Fistor-
The flag website proved nothing. It's a rumor website, look at the subtitle. And also, if you have done enough research (as you obviously have to argue so much) why don't you express some opinions on McCain? And obviously i'm anti-obama because he is a fetus-faced windbag.
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Post by Fistor on Aug 1, 2008 12:29:03 GMT -5
Fistor- The flag website proved nothing. It's a rumor website, look at the subtitle. And also, if you have done enough research (as you obviously have to argue so much) why don't you express some opinions on McCain? And obviously i'm anti-obama because he is a fetus-faced windbag. It's Snopes. It tries to prove or disprove rumors with actual facts. It's pretty well-known as the site you go to to find out if something is true or not. A fetus-faced windbag, huh? Wow. Tough to argue against that. Maybe if I said I think McCain is a big doody head? I'm currently undecided on which candidate to vote for. And nothing you've posted (except maybe the unmitigated fact that he is in fact a fetus-faced windbag) has helped sway me one way or another. |
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Post by kaboobie92 on Aug 1, 2008 12:43:55 GMT -5
Ok i have one question. Why, if Obama is so concerned about the poor, does he live in a 1.6 Million dollar house in a suburb of Chicago? If he is that concerned, why dosent he take some initiative. Its like with celebrities. Tons of celebrities get on commercials trying to get you to help an organization, but I guarantee most havent given them a dime (even though they are much more wealthy than most of us)
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Post by The Biff Lebowski on Aug 1, 2008 12:54:45 GMT -5
Ok i have one question. Why, if Obama is so concerned about the poor, does he live in a 1.6 Million dollar house in a suburb of Chicago? If he is that concerned, why dosent he take some initiative. Its like with celebrities. Tons of celebrities get on commercials trying to get you to help an organization, but I guarantee most havent given them a dime (even though they are much more wealthy than most of us) I lean right and on behalf of all of us who lean right: "Please stop embarrassing us". Thanks. |
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Post by kaboobie92 on Aug 1, 2008 12:58:45 GMT -5
Embarassing you? I'm trying to express my opinion. Just because you lean right dosen't mean you have to associate yourself with me
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Post by Fistor on Aug 1, 2008 12:59:12 GMT -5
Ok i have one question. Why, if Obama is so concerned about the poor, does he live in a 1.6 Million dollar house in a suburb of Chicago? Because he's rich, would be my guess. What kind of house does McCain live in? What kind of house do you live in? What, your dad doesn't care about the poor?  Why do you continue to argue? You clearly would consider any democrat Satan personified and elevate any Republican to god-like status. These arguments are silly. 7 pages in and you're bringing up old e-mails that have been disproved for months and Obama's choice of houses. Fine, you think he's doody-faced fetus brain. We get it. Now if you don't mind, maybe we can actually get to some issues that are, you know, pertinent? |
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Post by kaboobie92 on Aug 1, 2008 13:02:37 GMT -5
First off, I don't believe any "democrat is Satan personified". I have a lot of family members and friends who are liberals. The fact is that my disgust in Obama goes beyond his politics. Sure, I do disagree with about 99% of his platform, but he has proved he is dishonest, and has very little government experience. He dosen't have any experience with the military strategy (or the military in general) which is kinda important for the Commander In Chief. I respect your opinions Fistor, and everyone else in this board. I just don't trust him.
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Post by kaboobie92 on Aug 1, 2008 13:05:14 GMT -5
I'm curious Fistor-
What do you believe will help fix this economic mess that our country is in? Obama is for more government programs and un-supported tax cuts. While I agree that tax cuts are necessary, with the creation of government programs there won't be enough $$ to support the cuts. Also, Obama talks about moving out of Iraq, and then talks about how we need more troop presence in Afghanistan. I don't see how that will solve our Iraq spending problem. Instead of spending money in Iraq, we will just be spending more money in Afghanistan.
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Post by Fistor on Aug 1, 2008 13:17:35 GMT -5
I'm curious Fistor- What do you believe will help fix this economic mess that our country is in? I don't know. Obama is for more government programs and un-supported tax cuts. If his tax cuts are indeed "un-supported", then they won't come to fruition. Problem solved I guess. While I agree that tax cuts are necessary, with the creation of government programs there won't be enough $$ to support the cuts. My guess is some things cost more than others. Also, Obama talks about moving out of Iraq, and then talks about how we need more troop presence in Afghanistan. I don't see how that will solve our Iraq spending problem. Instead of spending money in Iraq, we will just be spending more money in Afghanistan. My guess is some things cost more than others. Does Obama pose that relocating troops to Afghanistan is the solution to the "Iraq spending problem"? Does he recommend the exact same number of troops in Afghanistan as are currently in Iraq? The same resources? The same equipment? Is McCain's plan of staying in Iraq indefinitely any sort of solution to the "Iraq spending problem"? |
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Post by kaboobie92 on Aug 1, 2008 13:23:39 GMT -5
McCain's plan won't solve the spending problem, obviously. Obama didn't pose the relocation as a solution, but people assume that all the spending from the war will stop if Obama is elected. He wants more troops in Afghanistan and has talked about helping to bring "peace" to Africa. Don't get me wrong, I'm not 100% McCain. I really wish that the GOP could've produced a better candidate (Fred Thompson, Mitt Romney). I just think that we need a TRUE republican economic policy to bring our economy back. And I know Obama won't, so i'm hoping McCain will.
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